Got to catch a private screening of it through the theatre.



God, have mercy for we act on deep misunderstandings.

I can't wait to check this one out ... here's the website: http://www.jesuscampthemovie.com/

that, my friends, scares me to death.

only thing worse, Bill, would be LIB camp...

?

The Lord's Innocent Bowhunters?

http://www.arizonachristianarchers.com/
http://www.christiandeerhunters.org/



~fff - np: bt - this binary universe

Awww! What's so awful about my camp? All we'd do is make mudpies and blow bubbles and draw pictures of anthropomorphized field mice... is that so bad?




I don't think I'll be able to watch this movie. I saw the trailer a few weeks ago, and it hit far too many nerves. I've been hit with enough environmental triggers this month to know to shield myself from something like this.

I know I'm only speaking from the trailer, but it seems to chronicle a lot of the bad aspects of my childhood, especially the various Pentecostal summer camps I'd attend and one DVBS I volunteered with for a week. It's creepy. It's overpowering. It's indoctrinating kids with a bunch of religious-sounding mish-mash and telling them that this is real spirituality -- and the widely-misused language of spiritual warfare isn't the worst of it, in my opinion. I believe spirituality is an individual journey, and using massive goup conditioning strategies to get kids to just follow the [human] leader robs them of that. In addition, groups like those documented in this film (as best I can tell from the clips) are the sort to later throw massive obstacles in the path of anyone who might grow up to look beyond the hype.

Maybe I'll be able to watch this in a few more years, but now, no.

I love you, Libby. (for the rest of your post too )

ditto.


btw.... even as a (somewhat) "conservative" Christian, this whole thing gives me the heeby jeebies (sp?).

As a solitary Pagan, it certainly gives me the creeps. It's downright scary.

Cher

Just watched the trailer. Wasn't that pretty much how they educated the Muslims who hijacked the jets? Guess we'll be evening the score for Jesus and then some...

Jesus Camp debate rages on.

Cher

one of the many reasons i've come to love the washington post is for their live online chats. one of today's was with the director of the movie.

transcript

Looks like it's over now.

This week just gets better and better...

I'm so sick of people perverting the real beauty of God and His Word.... bah.

If people would just read it..... and live it. Instead of all of this...... morons.

What a shock...! I think that may be the (very first) first time a fanatical-type was found to be fanatically covering something up...

Drippy wet with sarcasm,
T.

I think there will come a time in the not too distant future where Christianity will be held in the same regard Islam is now--not just by a few groups, but by the whole of the country, if not the world...

At a time when we have militant groups literally warring for their religious beliefs, lobbyists vying for the archival of all our childrens' DNA, and Subdermal chips implanted into human beings, one has to wonder where the line will ever be drawn? And by that I mean, who is really in power in this country or the world for that matter? Who shapes our future? Is there an overarching agenda, and if so, who is behind it?

Does it surprise anyone that the US government has a department dedicated to analyzing biblical prophecies, and the end of world, ie. Armageddon? And does it actually stop at analysis, or does it go past that into attempted manipulation of the elements involved in the prophecies?

How little do we all really know?

Sorry for the hijack. All this just reminded me of all that I've been processing in my mind lately.

I understand your anguish, but I wish people would just live it. Forget faith, belief, reading, and worship. Forget everything but loving and helping fellow living beings. That end in and of itself is self-evidently necessary, and simultaneously the right thing to do.

But that's just me, and I'm weird, and born about a century or two too early.

the daily show showed clips of the movie, too. watch them here.

Too bad it's hate rather than logic that shut the camp down.

Cher

In response to your statements, not the movie, which I haven't seen, regarding personal agendas, governmental agendas, prophesies, and manipulation, here is my personal take, for what it's worth. I was raised Dutch Reformed with some Baptist Bible School and camping on the side, grew up with my teen years in the 70's, spent my high school years at the #1 girls prep/boarding school in the USA in the 70's (all 153 of us at the start), lived with my teachers and girls from round the world for 3 years, took dance and horsebackriding and tennis (there was no Phys Ed, per se), and had a grandfather who, having lived in Cuba as a young newlywed risked his life in traveling back to Cuba and getting his friends' money out of Cuba during the revolution, all whilst risking his life.

So what do I think about all this stuff? How little do we really know, you ask? All I know is that I am incredibly blessed, now that I've had my nursing licence for almost 1.5 yrs, to meet critically ill people and their families, from all races and national origins, and they depend on me. What I see is that within most families, regardless of their faith compared to mine, if they have love in their hearts and they can see it in mine, even if we can't speak much of each others' languages, then there is a common respect. There is a steadfast knowing that we are on the same page, and neither the price of oil nor the body count in the current war can displace that. When we heal, we heal together.

-Carolyn

I hate this!
I absolutely hate it.
And I can't believe so many otherwise intelligent people are buying into the hype.
The problem with this film is the problem with so many other recent, overrated "documentaries". It's done with an obvious agenda that goes basically unnoticed or unreported. It uses distortions and half truths (like the clip with the lady talking about Palestinian kids and hand grenades. Obviously cut off to make it sound like...why even bother.) Agree with Christianity or don't. That's your right. But this film is a shameful attempt to equate Christianity with Hamas or Al-Quada. I don't like the unfortunate fruits of a lot of fundamental Christianity either, but the picture this filmmaker is trying to portray is not an accurate description of most of Christianity. This kind of crap just pisses me off. Like little Christian children are who we need to be afraid of these days...

The most valuable lesson -- that the West seems to not want to learn -- nutjobs come in all colors, and they all count on the pliable, desperate, dumb and intellectually lazy to carry forth their insane legacy of hatred, self-righteousness and disrespect for logic and science.

Smart, secure people don't blow themselves up and they don't worship someone like an elected official.

No one counts on keeping people down like fundamentalists do.

Right now?! Lady, you're camp ain't ever safe.

From my late teens to my mid 30s, I was firmly in the evangelical camp and subculture. While I'm more a wandering, seeking Christian these days (and firmly NOT in the fundie/evangelical camps), I've directly experienced the kind of accusations and intolerance that firebrand faith can fuel. When I first separated, my then-wife accused me essentially of trafficking with demons and being under hellish influence (because there couldn't possibly be any reason for me wanting to end the marriage ). When I told her I didn't read Genesis as a literal science manual on how the universe was created, she told me I was "calling God a liar."

I have the utmost respect for people striving to love themselves and others with healthy, patience mercy and grace. I have none for people who think it's their primary calling to tell me exactly how to live my life.

It concerns me that we have the rise of such fundamentailist religious beliefs coming from all camps these days---

I think that this really serves to turn people off from God--I have to admit that I am one.

I do consider myself spiritual but not religious. I was born Catholic but don't practice any religious faith any longer.

It seems to me that so many who call themselves "Christian" are anything but---they certainly are extremely judgemental and want to impose a set of beliefs upon everyone to make up for the fact they cannot persuade others to their beliefs. By absolute and ultimate force if necessary.

For those of you who are old enough to remember watching the late comedian Red Skelton on television many years ago--he would always end his show by saying these three words: "May God Bless!"

In the late 1970s, I had a chance to see Red Skelton do a live performance in Savannah, Georgia not too long before he died.

He closed his live show with those three same words and he explained what he meant by those words further.

Mr. Skelton said that he was not making a demand of God, but a request--he was asking God to bless his audience for man could never presume for or make demands of God--

It seems that is a problem with fundamentalist types including Imans, preachers, popes and rabbis as well as the rank and file followers of such religious groups--they are very eager to presume for God!!!!!!

I wonder what Jesus would say about that????

I finally watched this film tonight. Everyone should see this. It's an eye-opener.

Very much unlike Kelvin's perspective, I did not find this to be an anti-Christian film. In fact the film showed differing Christian perspectives, especially comments along the lines of what Jesus actually said and did not say. It's easy to hate a film from a biased poin of view.

This isn't just a Christian thing. The techniques used at the camp are the same employed by cults - all fall under under Large Group Awareness Training (LGAT). Reminds me of Steve Taylor's old song "I Manipulate."

Go rent this film.

This is basically a film made by a nutjob about other nutjobs. I find it kind of interesting in that regard but it is creepy.

I do enjoy Saved! though. A lot of people thought the satire went overboard, but I had friends that actually did everything portrayed in that movie.

That's a pretty inflammatory comment to make for this board. Two people made this film, so which one is the "nutjob" and what supporting facts can you offer?